Aoifinn Devitt: What does it mean to lift as you climb? And why should young people not wait to make a difference in other people’s lives? Let’s find out next. I’m Aoifinn Devitt, and welcome to the 50 Faces Podcast, a podcast committed to revealing the richness and diversity of the world of investment by focusing on its people and their stories. I’m joined today by Justyna Eteh, who is a transaction banking associate at a large global investment bank based in London. She hails from Ghana, where we’re recording from today, and she participated in a graduate training program sponsored by Bank of America. She spends a lot of her time mentoring young Black students and colleagues, and I am thrilled to hear her insights here. Welcome, Justyna. Thank you for joining me today.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Thank you so much, Aoifinn. It’s a real pleasure to be on the show with you.
Aoifinn Devitt: Let’s start with how you wanted to study investment and your journey into that, maybe starting with where you went to school and your college degree.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: So to give you a bit of background, I grew up in Ghana. I, you know, I was raised pretty much from my dad, so I did all my schooling in Ghana. And growing up, we weren’t— well, we necessarily didn’t, you know, kind of endure poverty. We were surrounded by it. And my dad is someone who would describe himself as somebody who didn’t come from anything but made a lot out of himself. So he was keen on making sure that we, you know, were equipped with the right tools for success in life. And one key thing he believed in was financial literacy. He was always going on about how we need to understand the concepts of money and the principles that describe money, making money, how to earn it, keep it, and grow it, and all of that. So yeah, that was— we as kids, we kept, you know, we weren’t really, you know, we didn’t really have a good understanding of what he was doing for us and, you know, what he was trying to show us. But I know he would go as far as making examples of some of our neighbors and say that— let’s call a neighbor Mr. Smith— and say, you know, Mr. Smith, who doesn’t have much money, is looking forward to borrowing money as soon as he gets a big bonus from work. He makes— he throws a big party for himself. That is not how to attain, you know, financial liberation. And he would show us and make us discuss all of that. That really gave me, you know, this desire, empathy for others, and, you know, wanting to get a career to help people become more financially secure. So that’s how it started for me in terms of my background and my interest in investments and how he helped us get our own investments at a very young age.
Aoifinn Devitt: And what did you then continue to study either at school, high school, or university?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so throughout my education, so in high school, we tend to do all the, you know, the mix. There’s a Ghanaian curriculum and they give us a mix of a mixed bag. But by uni, I focused on economics. And that was— I was so grateful for that opportunity. Because it wasn’t just interesting, it was very real and practical to me. It opened my eyes to the increasing interconnectedness of the world. And, you know, if we think today about how before I think that what has a virus got to do with the economy? Like, has it got any relation at all? But you learn how it’s quarantining, how people are not able to produce things, how that can you affect, know, the growth of the economy as a whole, and how what happens in one country definitely has an impact on another because we’re all part of the globe in one world. So that was definitely very interesting for me, and it was so real, and it got me interested in the investment space. It made it quite clear, much clearer to me at that stage.
Aoifinn Devitt: And then the, the graduate program that you participated on, can you tell us about that?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so that’s actually a very fantastic program that I’m so proud of. So it just started, you know, with my institution, a group of people saying, let’s do more about diversity. We do not have enough diverse candidates in our organization, and we want to do something about it. Now I’m really happy about that because it didn’t just remain as an idea or like, you know, a boardroom discussion. People actually came all the way to, you know, Ghana, Nigeria, spoke to people like me to inspire us, you know, to give us the ideas that ought to grow our imaginations for us to realize that we could. So that’s the program that they came up with, and that is how some of us have been inspired and we are here today. So it’s basically a program that brings students from different African countries to come and do an internship in London. This year, unfortunately, we had to do a virtual one, but it still went quite well. But to bring interns to do an internship, and then, you know, we go through the normal standard test that every other candidate would go through, and then some are, you know, given full-time offers, and, you know, it goes on like that. And I’ve been with the company for 4 years now doing amazing things.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s wonderful. And what percentage of the students, say, in your class were actually getting internship opportunities like this?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: So that would be maybe about 20% of the class will get the internship offer. And out of that 20%, I’ll say maybe 5% to 10% will get full-time offers.
Aoifinn Devitt: So there seems to— it’s a new initiative, but it seems that still there’s quite a substantial number of offers coming out of it, at least either the internship offers, at least there’s still a substantial opportunity. What would the other cohort in your class have done, those that didn’t go abroad for internships? Were they looking at opportunities locally?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so people have actually done real amazing things. There’s a huge— so my university has a huge focus on entrepreneurship, and I see friends that have started I businesses. Have a clothing-making business. People are doing really well. A lot of people are focused on doing things that impact the community. So because we’ve really been given the tools to succeed, it doesn’t matter whether we go abroad or not. Everybody’s thinking about the things they can do to implement change and just make their own corner better. So I’ve seen a lot, I’m really proud of my group and I’ve seen that there’s been a lot of growth and a lot of things that people have done.
Aoifinn Devitt: And in terms of your own personal experience being a young Black woman working now in London, have there been any obstacles that you’ve faced along the way in this period?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I think there’s definitely been a few. So for me, if you think about it, I didn’t necessarily have the idea of my skin color defining me in any way, just because of where I grew up and where I came from. I grew up where everybody pretty much is Black like me, and so that didn’t have, you know, effect. That wasn’t a factor at all. But I guess we had our own ways of differentiating people, just as any community does. So initially, it was a bit of a shock for me that before I opened my mouth, before I say anything, people already had preconceptions about who I’d be. They think that I’m probably disadvantaged or, you know, just make judgments about where I come from. People make side notes like, oh, your parents must be really proud of you, and, you know, all of those things, which are really good things to say. But I guess sometimes you just see what people are thinking, or you try to— they make a hint of what they’re thinking and you get the idea. So So that initially was discouraging, but now that I have, I guess, some level of understanding of what people might think, be thinking and all of that, it’s made things easier. I try to tell my story in a much clearer way before people tell me who I am. And yeah, so that has been interesting from that point of view for me to learn in my career. But yeah, it’s been good. It’s been generally good.
Aoifinn Devitt: And I know that you make a very strong effort to mentor other Black women or other women from other minorities, whether around you in um, London, and maybe you also do that back in Ghana. Can you tell us, um, what you do there?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so I think, and this maybe is one thing that I’ve been thinking about a lot more given everything that’s going on, I think we all have a responsibility to do something. So when this whole Black Lives Matter movement started happening, I had a discussion with some of my friends that what can we do, and some people kept saying that you know what, maybe one day if I become somebody, then I can do something. And I’ve actually been challenging my friends, including myself, that no, we are somebody now and we can do something. We don’t have to wait till we become whoever we think we’ll become before we do something good. Because if I think about it, 4 years ago, 5 years ago, I wasn’t here, so I can help somebody be where I am. And that motto of lifting as I climb is really what I’ve been challenging myself to do. So I could be mentoring somebody who is maybe just 2 years younger than me, but the real challenge for me, or the real thing that I try to do, is to get people to think more about what they could be doing. And that way I challenge myself as well. So that, that is the real discussion that I have with, you know, other Black people or other Black women that I talk to, because sometimes people just lower their gaze and decide that what they want from the world, I think sometimes it’s really small. They could aim for more, but it’s just because of what they’ve been told about themselves, what they’ve seen around them. They tend to have like really small goals. I remember having discussions with some young girls and they were telling me how they wanted to be dancers in music videos because that’s just what they’ve seen other people who look like them do. So they find it really encouraging when I tell them, look, I’m a Ghanaian, I didn’t school in the UK, I work for this large institution in the UK. So that is really the main idea behind me talking to these women. I just want to encourage more people to do more for themselves.
Aoifinn Devitt: I suppose there are very many layers at which you could be a role model, whether to high school students considering a university degree in economics or finance, back at your alma mater, you know, working with the students who are looking at their next career path, And equally, I think sharing your experience in London is probably very valuable with the new graduates entering the profession. Is there any particular way that you mentor them, those that have already decided to choose a path in finance, maybe to help them progress optimally?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, absolutely. So as you said, there are multiple layers to that. There’s a first level of helping people dream of even getting into it. And then the second level is once they’ve already— once they’re already convinced that they actually consider a career in that How do you actually help them secure internships? And then the next level, once they’ve gotten the internships, how do you help them convert those internships to full-time offers? Once you get into a full-time offer, how do you actually succeed in this super competitive environment? And I try to do all of those according to all— across all those layers. So I’ve been speaking to, as you said, students from my alma mater. There’s been so many students that have come right after me just because of me telling them, well, partly because of me telling them, you know, my story, telling them that they can actually do it, giving them real practical tips of what to read, who to speak to, how to speak to them, what to be talking about, what is relevant to speak about. So things like that. And then when they’re actually in the internship, again, similar advice, helping them, giving, trying to give them that visibility and that voice. And then now once you, you know, get a full-time offer, How do you not struggle from imposter syndrome? How do you know? And it’s great that I have gone through some of these things because I can already tell them when they come. Sometimes I can tell people that I see that your confidence level is really low. You were a superstar where you came from. Suddenly you feel you like, know, this is absolutely normal. And I know because I’ve been through it. And that is so, you know, people can connect with you when you’ve been through a similar scenario or a similar situation as them. So I found that people have really benefited from my experience, just as I have benefited from other people’s experiences.
Aoifinn Devitt: And are there any particular concrete offerings such as either mentorship programs, network opportunities, coaching programs that you think are more useful than others perhaps?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: I think all mentorship is useful, but maybe what really helps or differentiates is when people can relates with who they’re speaking with, which is why maybe people find it difficult when people are just connected, you know, with no context whatsoever. But when there’s context, when people can— and I think overall empathy is the most important thing. So the person doesn’t have to look like you for you to see that, you know, they empathize with you or for you to benefit from them. I don’t think so. But I think real empathy, real, you know, people listening and people willing to do things for others really, really helps and makes a difference. So that’s what really makes mentorship important, and that’s what distinguishes, you know, good mentorship versus just any plain type of mentorship. Having that listening ear, empathizing with the others, and yeah, just being willing to share your stories, having that open and frank conversation. Whereas if you’re thinking twice about what you’re saying and worried about what that might be, not really trusting each other, then I think both parties might not benefit from it.
Aoifinn Devitt: And looking back at your own career so far and your time in university and school, were there any particular people who had an influence on you and who you are today?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so I think almost everybody I’ve had an interaction with, I think, has influenced me, some more than others, but you always learn something from somebody, even if you think it’s a difficult person you’re working with, whatever it might be, it gives you a reason to go home and think about what you could do differently. So I think overall, just my, you know, interaction with different people, you know, my lecturers back in uni challenging me, telling me I can do more, all of those things. The key mentors, the key people that I’ve interacted with all have definitely challenged me to think more and dream bigger dreams for myself. But I think I’m really, really grateful for the upbringing that I guess my dad gave me growing up. He was always, you know, focusing on values, as I mentioned earlier. And one story that sticks with me to date is one time when he took me back to his village where he came from, and the main reason he gave was just because he wanted me to have an appreciation of where he came from so I wouldn’t think life is rosy. Now, me thinking of myself as a city girl, I get there and they offer me water to drink from a calabash. Basically the water was from the surface of the earth, and I was thinking to myself, no way am I drinking this water. I look at my dad, he was— he had a stern look on his face, so I quickly drank the water. But anyway, beyond that water, that experience with the people, speaking to them, it was really humbling for me, and that really created a sense of, you know, empathy within me. But also it filled me with a lot of gratitude, and I still live with that gratitude today. It doesn’t matter what happens. I’m always grateful for how far, you know, I’ve come. And I realize and I recognize my privilege. It doesn’t matter what I think I have to complain about. So, and I think those values are things that, yeah, like, are really helpful in terms of a career, in terms of how patient we are, how grateful we are, and how fulfilling life can be for us. I’m grateful for all those lessons that he taught me. Right at a young age.
Aoifinn Devitt: And was there any one piece of advice that you received over the way, or any— you mentioned already your very compelling “Lift as I climb.” Any other creed or motto that you live by?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Well, in terms of career, so I remember one time, one mentor spoke to me about the career triangle. So thinking about career assets, career needs, and the purpose. And the point about purpose really, really stood out to me because At the time, I had just completed a community service project in Ghana. So I was working with an organization that received funding from Bill Gates. And essentially what the organization was doing was helping underprivileged women. Now, these women were involved in making one of the staple foods in Ghana called garri for, you know, poor people. And the process itself of making the food was so laborious and it was a health hazard because they were inhaling a lot of smoke because they made their food from firewood. And so we designed a machine to help them make food quicker and in a healthy way so they don’t have to inhale all of all of those, the smoke. Now, I wasn’t part of the design team or anything like that. I was more on the finance side, helping them, advising them, helping them structure, organize themselves in a way to be eligible for the loans that we could provide them because they didn’t have any money to provide, you know, to obtain their machines. And because of the fact that I believed in the bigger picture, what we’re trying to do for these women, even though I wasn’t necessarily designing the machines, just because I believed in the bigger picture and the purpose, I was working so hard I couldn’t even feel it. Like, I would go home and feel the pains and aches, but I didn’t realize I’d been standing 6 hours talking to these women. And one thing that really helped was that because I speak about 5 languages, so I could speak most of their languages. And that really helped them trust me. And I gave so much to that work. It wasn’t super paid or anything like that. It was a service job. And so as my mentor spoke to me about purpose, I thought about that experience. And it made me think that if we could all find some purpose, we might not be able to find our full purpose in our jobs, in our day-to-day jobs. But if we can find some purpose in it, we’ll be more productive, more efficient, and we will be able to do more. We’ll just live happier and more fulfilling lives because we’ll just be working towards things we believe in. So that’s one thing that I’ve had in mind for some time now.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s extremely powerful, and it reminds me of some of these microfinance initiatives that are part of impact investing in many cases.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Exactly.
Aoifinn Devitt: It’s a good segue to my next question, which is, what is it that you love about the world of investing?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I think I love the fact that it’s real. I love the fact that it gives people an opportunity to, you know, achieve their full potential in terms of, you know, the finances that they have. They’re able to do more with it. It can also give people an opportunity to secure, you know, their future and all of that. And more importantly, at the bare minimum, it can help some people to, um, escape poverty like we’re talking about earlier. Although things happen and it’s not always, you know, guaranteed and all of that, but it’s just the power that it has to give people financial security. And the fact that it’s real, yeah, excites me a lot. And it’s changing every day, it’s so dynamic.
Aoifinn Devitt: And what are your thoughts on the current level of diversity in the profession and where it’s moving in terms of progress that has been made? And even over recent months, we’ve seen a number of statements committed to improving the ethnic diversity. What are your thoughts on that?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I think, as you said, like, there’s definitely more that can be done in terms of diversity. So I was reading somewhere that there are only 12 portfolio managers in the UK, and I was thinking, as in Black portfolio managers in the UK, and I was thinking that is just not reflective at all. So, and if I think about even women and all of this, so there could definitely be a lot more diversity, or we could all embark on more diverse initiatives, um, in this industry, but I think that over the last few months there’s been a lot. We’ve seen a lot of pledges, a lot of hard work, we’ve seen what Dawid and his team are working on to recruit more, you know, young Black talent into the industry, so all of those things are really exciting, but I hope that we move from, you know, ideas and pledges and speeches to actually doing things that intangible results. So yeah.
Aoifinn Devitt: And it’s interesting you mentioned Dawoud Kanaté Ahulu, who was on an earlier podcast and speaking about his initiatives around hiring more, 100 I believe, Black front office staff and into portfolio managers. And I’ve just seen, I think the speed at which these initiatives have gained currency, have gained a following, is that should give us all a lot of hope. I believe that this is not just about, as you said, pledges and statements, but it’s been followed by action, and that firms are increasingly being held to demonstrate that their action will follow. Just a final question around what advice you would give. You clearly are not looking back too far to the students perhaps in university, but if you were to give those students advice, what would that be today, knowing what you know now?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Great. So I think I’ll tell people to lift their gaze, look beyond the horizon that they think they can see. Because what happens is that sometimes people make their dreams based on the interactions that they have with the people around them, so that can be quite limiting, especially if you’re from an underprivileged background. You think nobody from my family has been to uni, so it’s okay that I’ve been to uni, but you don’t even think about how much more that you can do for yourself. So even when people say that you can’t be what you can’t see, I still think that there’s a power of imagination. So maybe people can leverage that power of imagination so well. There’s a book by a guy called, I think, Yuval Noah. He wrote Homo sapiens. And in there, he was talking about how human beings are differentiated from other animals because we have the power of imagination, and I think that’s really powerful. So I’d encourage young people in university to imagine more, to dream bigger dreams, to aim above the sky so that if you fall, you are just at the sky, and not be limited in their dreams and in the scope of who they can be. So that’s definitely one thing I’ll challenge people to do, and it’s not just saying that to them. If I spoke to somebody, I’ll say, well, if you challenge yourself to dream bigger, what would that look like? What would that be? How would you work towards that?
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, thank you, Justyna. Thank you for your imagination. You are such an inspiration, and I can’t wait to see how far you will climb and all those women you lift with you. So thank you again, and thank you for sharing your insights with us.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I appreciate it. I’m so glad for this opportunity.
Aoifinn Devitt: I’m Aoifinn Devitt. Thank you for listening to the 50 Faces Podcast. If you liked what you heard and would like to tune in to hear more inspiring investors and their personal journeys, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be construed as investment advice, and all views are personal and should not be attributed to the organizations and affiliations of the host or any guest.
Aoifinn Devitt: What does it mean to lift as you climb? And why should young people not wait to make a difference in other people’s lives? Let’s find out next. I’m Aoifinn Devitt, and welcome to the 50 Faces Podcast, a podcast committed to revealing the richness and diversity of the world of investment by focusing on its people and their stories. I’m joined today by Justyna Eteh, who is a transaction banking associate at a large global investment bank based in London. She hails from Ghana, where we’re recording from today, and she participated in a graduate training program sponsored by Bank of America. She spends a lot of her time mentoring young Black students and colleagues, and I am thrilled to hear her insights here. Welcome, Justyna. Thank you for joining me today.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Thank you so much, Aoifinn. It’s a real pleasure to be on the show with you.
Aoifinn Devitt: Let’s start with how you wanted to study investment and your journey into that, maybe starting with where you went to school and your college degree.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: So to give you a bit of background, I grew up in Ghana. I, you know, I was raised pretty much from my dad, so I did all my schooling in Ghana. And growing up, we weren’t— well, we necessarily didn’t, you know, kind of endure poverty. We were surrounded by it. And my dad is someone who would describe himself as somebody who didn’t come from anything but made a lot out of himself. So he was keen on making sure that we, you know, were equipped with the right tools for success in life. And one key thing he believed in was financial literacy. He was always going on about how we need to understand the concepts of money and the principles that describe money, making money, how to earn it, keep it, and grow it, and all of that. So yeah, that was— we as kids, we kept, you know, we weren’t really, you know, we didn’t really have a good understanding of what he was doing for us and, you know, what he was trying to show us. But I know he would go as far as making examples of some of our neighbors and say that— let’s call a neighbor Mr. Smith— and say, you know, Mr. Smith, who doesn’t have much money, is looking forward to borrowing money as soon as he gets a big bonus from work. He makes— he throws a big party for himself. That is not how to attain, you know, financial liberation. And he would show us and make us discuss all of that. That really gave me, you know, this desire, empathy for others, and, you know, wanting to get a career to help people become more financially secure. So that’s how it started for me in terms of my background and my interest in investments and how he helped us get our own investments at a very young age.
Aoifinn Devitt: And what did you then continue to study either at school, high school, or university?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so throughout my education, so in high school, we tend to do all the, you know, the mix. There’s a Ghanaian curriculum and they give us a mix of a mixed bag. But by uni, I focused on economics. And that was— I was so grateful for that opportunity. Because it wasn’t just interesting, it was very real and practical to me. It opened my eyes to the increasing interconnectedness of the world. And, you know, if we think today about how before I think that what has a virus got to do with the economy? Like, has it got any relation at all? But you learn how it’s quarantining, how people are not able to produce things, how that can you affect, know, the growth of the economy as a whole, and how what happens in one country definitely has an impact on another because we’re all part of the globe in one world. So that was definitely very interesting for me, and it was so real, and it got me interested in the investment space. It made it quite clear, much clearer to me at that stage.
Aoifinn Devitt: And then the, the graduate program that you participated on, can you tell us about that?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so that’s actually a very fantastic program that I’m so proud of. So it just started, you know, with my institution, a group of people saying, let’s do more about diversity. We do not have enough diverse candidates in our organization, and we want to do something about it. Now I’m really happy about that because it didn’t just remain as an idea or like, you know, a boardroom discussion. People actually came all the way to, you know, Ghana, Nigeria, spoke to people like me to inspire us, you know, to give us the ideas that ought to grow our imaginations for us to realize that we could. So that’s the program that they came up with, and that is how some of us have been inspired and we are here today. So it’s basically a program that brings students from different African countries to come and do an internship in London. This year, unfortunately, we had to do a virtual one, but it still went quite well. But to bring interns to do an internship, and then, you know, we go through the normal standard test that every other candidate would go through, and then some are, you know, given full-time offers, and, you know, it goes on like that. And I’ve been with the company for 4 years now doing amazing things.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s wonderful. And what percentage of the students, say, in your class were actually getting internship opportunities like this?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: So that would be maybe about 20% of the class will get the internship offer. And out of that 20%, I’ll say maybe 5% to 10% will get full-time offers.
Aoifinn Devitt: So there seems to— it’s a new initiative, but it seems that still there’s quite a substantial number of offers coming out of it, at least either the internship offers, at least there’s still a substantial opportunity. What would the other cohort in your class have done, those that didn’t go abroad for internships? Were they looking at opportunities locally?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so people have actually done real amazing things. There’s a huge— so my university has a huge focus on entrepreneurship, and I see friends that have started I businesses. Have a clothing-making business. People are doing really well. A lot of people are focused on doing things that impact the community. So because we’ve really been given the tools to succeed, it doesn’t matter whether we go abroad or not. Everybody’s thinking about the things they can do to implement change and just make their own corner better. So I’ve seen a lot, I’m really proud of my group and I’ve seen that there’s been a lot of growth and a lot of things that people have done.
Aoifinn Devitt: And in terms of your own personal experience being a young Black woman working now in London, have there been any obstacles that you’ve faced along the way in this period?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I think there’s definitely been a few. So for me, if you think about it, I didn’t necessarily have the idea of my skin color defining me in any way, just because of where I grew up and where I came from. I grew up where everybody pretty much is Black like me, and so that didn’t have, you know, effect. That wasn’t a factor at all. But I guess we had our own ways of differentiating people, just as any community does. So initially, it was a bit of a shock for me that before I opened my mouth, before I say anything, people already had preconceptions about who I’d be. They think that I’m probably disadvantaged or, you know, just make judgments about where I come from. People make side notes like, oh, your parents must be really proud of you, and, you know, all of those things, which are really good things to say. But I guess sometimes you just see what people are thinking, or you try to— they make a hint of what they’re thinking and you get the idea. So So that initially was discouraging, but now that I have, I guess, some level of understanding of what people might think, be thinking and all of that, it’s made things easier. I try to tell my story in a much clearer way before people tell me who I am. And yeah, so that has been interesting from that point of view for me to learn in my career. But yeah, it’s been good. It’s been generally good.
Aoifinn Devitt: And I know that you make a very strong effort to mentor other Black women or other women from other minorities, whether around you in um, London, and maybe you also do that back in Ghana. Can you tell us, um, what you do there?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so I think, and this maybe is one thing that I’ve been thinking about a lot more given everything that’s going on, I think we all have a responsibility to do something. So when this whole Black Lives Matter movement started happening, I had a discussion with some of my friends that what can we do, and some people kept saying that you know what, maybe one day if I become somebody, then I can do something. And I’ve actually been challenging my friends, including myself, that no, we are somebody now and we can do something. We don’t have to wait till we become whoever we think we’ll become before we do something good. Because if I think about it, 4 years ago, 5 years ago, I wasn’t here, so I can help somebody be where I am. And that motto of lifting as I climb is really what I’ve been challenging myself to do. So I could be mentoring somebody who is maybe just 2 years younger than me, but the real challenge for me, or the real thing that I try to do, is to get people to think more about what they could be doing. And that way I challenge myself as well. So that, that is the real discussion that I have with, you know, other Black people or other Black women that I talk to, because sometimes people just lower their gaze and decide that what they want from the world, I think sometimes it’s really small. They could aim for more, but it’s just because of what they’ve been told about themselves, what they’ve seen around them. They tend to have like really small goals. I remember having discussions with some young girls and they were telling me how they wanted to be dancers in music videos because that’s just what they’ve seen other people who look like them do. So they find it really encouraging when I tell them, look, I’m a Ghanaian, I didn’t school in the UK, I work for this large institution in the UK. So that is really the main idea behind me talking to these women. I just want to encourage more people to do more for themselves.
Aoifinn Devitt: I suppose there are very many layers at which you could be a role model, whether to high school students considering a university degree in economics or finance, back at your alma mater, you know, working with the students who are looking at their next career path, And equally, I think sharing your experience in London is probably very valuable with the new graduates entering the profession. Is there any particular way that you mentor them, those that have already decided to choose a path in finance, maybe to help them progress optimally?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, absolutely. So as you said, there are multiple layers to that. There’s a first level of helping people dream of even getting into it. And then the second level is once they’ve already— once they’re already convinced that they actually consider a career in that How do you actually help them secure internships? And then the next level, once they’ve gotten the internships, how do you help them convert those internships to full-time offers? Once you get into a full-time offer, how do you actually succeed in this super competitive environment? And I try to do all of those according to all— across all those layers. So I’ve been speaking to, as you said, students from my alma mater. There’s been so many students that have come right after me just because of me telling them, well, partly because of me telling them, you know, my story, telling them that they can actually do it, giving them real practical tips of what to read, who to speak to, how to speak to them, what to be talking about, what is relevant to speak about. So things like that. And then when they’re actually in the internship, again, similar advice, helping them, giving, trying to give them that visibility and that voice. And then now once you, you know, get a full-time offer, How do you not struggle from imposter syndrome? How do you know? And it’s great that I have gone through some of these things because I can already tell them when they come. Sometimes I can tell people that I see that your confidence level is really low. You were a superstar where you came from. Suddenly you feel you like, know, this is absolutely normal. And I know because I’ve been through it. And that is so, you know, people can connect with you when you’ve been through a similar scenario or a similar situation as them. So I found that people have really benefited from my experience, just as I have benefited from other people’s experiences.
Aoifinn Devitt: And are there any particular concrete offerings such as either mentorship programs, network opportunities, coaching programs that you think are more useful than others perhaps?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: I think all mentorship is useful, but maybe what really helps or differentiates is when people can relates with who they’re speaking with, which is why maybe people find it difficult when people are just connected, you know, with no context whatsoever. But when there’s context, when people can— and I think overall empathy is the most important thing. So the person doesn’t have to look like you for you to see that, you know, they empathize with you or for you to benefit from them. I don’t think so. But I think real empathy, real, you know, people listening and people willing to do things for others really, really helps and makes a difference. So that’s what really makes mentorship important, and that’s what distinguishes, you know, good mentorship versus just any plain type of mentorship. Having that listening ear, empathizing with the others, and yeah, just being willing to share your stories, having that open and frank conversation. Whereas if you’re thinking twice about what you’re saying and worried about what that might be, not really trusting each other, then I think both parties might not benefit from it.
Aoifinn Devitt: And looking back at your own career so far and your time in university and school, were there any particular people who had an influence on you and who you are today?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, so I think almost everybody I’ve had an interaction with, I think, has influenced me, some more than others, but you always learn something from somebody, even if you think it’s a difficult person you’re working with, whatever it might be, it gives you a reason to go home and think about what you could do differently. So I think overall, just my, you know, interaction with different people, you know, my lecturers back in uni challenging me, telling me I can do more, all of those things. The key mentors, the key people that I’ve interacted with all have definitely challenged me to think more and dream bigger dreams for myself. But I think I’m really, really grateful for the upbringing that I guess my dad gave me growing up. He was always, you know, focusing on values, as I mentioned earlier. And one story that sticks with me to date is one time when he took me back to his village where he came from, and the main reason he gave was just because he wanted me to have an appreciation of where he came from so I wouldn’t think life is rosy. Now, me thinking of myself as a city girl, I get there and they offer me water to drink from a calabash. Basically the water was from the surface of the earth, and I was thinking to myself, no way am I drinking this water. I look at my dad, he was— he had a stern look on his face, so I quickly drank the water. But anyway, beyond that water, that experience with the people, speaking to them, it was really humbling for me, and that really created a sense of, you know, empathy within me. But also it filled me with a lot of gratitude, and I still live with that gratitude today. It doesn’t matter what happens. I’m always grateful for how far, you know, I’ve come. And I realize and I recognize my privilege. It doesn’t matter what I think I have to complain about. So, and I think those values are things that, yeah, like, are really helpful in terms of a career, in terms of how patient we are, how grateful we are, and how fulfilling life can be for us. I’m grateful for all those lessons that he taught me. Right at a young age.
Aoifinn Devitt: And was there any one piece of advice that you received over the way, or any— you mentioned already your very compelling “Lift as I climb.” Any other creed or motto that you live by?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Well, in terms of career, so I remember one time, one mentor spoke to me about the career triangle. So thinking about career assets, career needs, and the purpose. And the point about purpose really, really stood out to me because At the time, I had just completed a community service project in Ghana. So I was working with an organization that received funding from Bill Gates. And essentially what the organization was doing was helping underprivileged women. Now, these women were involved in making one of the staple foods in Ghana called garri for, you know, poor people. And the process itself of making the food was so laborious and it was a health hazard because they were inhaling a lot of smoke because they made their food from firewood. And so we designed a machine to help them make food quicker and in a healthy way so they don’t have to inhale all of all of those, the smoke. Now, I wasn’t part of the design team or anything like that. I was more on the finance side, helping them, advising them, helping them structure, organize themselves in a way to be eligible for the loans that we could provide them because they didn’t have any money to provide, you know, to obtain their machines. And because of the fact that I believed in the bigger picture, what we’re trying to do for these women, even though I wasn’t necessarily designing the machines, just because I believed in the bigger picture and the purpose, I was working so hard I couldn’t even feel it. Like, I would go home and feel the pains and aches, but I didn’t realize I’d been standing 6 hours talking to these women. And one thing that really helped was that because I speak about 5 languages, so I could speak most of their languages. And that really helped them trust me. And I gave so much to that work. It wasn’t super paid or anything like that. It was a service job. And so as my mentor spoke to me about purpose, I thought about that experience. And it made me think that if we could all find some purpose, we might not be able to find our full purpose in our jobs, in our day-to-day jobs. But if we can find some purpose in it, we’ll be more productive, more efficient, and we will be able to do more. We’ll just live happier and more fulfilling lives because we’ll just be working towards things we believe in. So that’s one thing that I’ve had in mind for some time now.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s extremely powerful, and it reminds me of some of these microfinance initiatives that are part of impact investing in many cases.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Exactly.
Aoifinn Devitt: It’s a good segue to my next question, which is, what is it that you love about the world of investing?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I think I love the fact that it’s real. I love the fact that it gives people an opportunity to, you know, achieve their full potential in terms of, you know, the finances that they have. They’re able to do more with it. It can also give people an opportunity to secure, you know, their future and all of that. And more importantly, at the bare minimum, it can help some people to, um, escape poverty like we’re talking about earlier. Although things happen and it’s not always, you know, guaranteed and all of that, but it’s just the power that it has to give people financial security. And the fact that it’s real, yeah, excites me a lot. And it’s changing every day, it’s so dynamic.
Aoifinn Devitt: And what are your thoughts on the current level of diversity in the profession and where it’s moving in terms of progress that has been made? And even over recent months, we’ve seen a number of statements committed to improving the ethnic diversity. What are your thoughts on that?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I think, as you said, like, there’s definitely more that can be done in terms of diversity. So I was reading somewhere that there are only 12 portfolio managers in the UK, and I was thinking, as in Black portfolio managers in the UK, and I was thinking that is just not reflective at all. So, and if I think about even women and all of this, so there could definitely be a lot more diversity, or we could all embark on more diverse initiatives, um, in this industry, but I think that over the last few months there’s been a lot. We’ve seen a lot of pledges, a lot of hard work, we’ve seen what Dawid and his team are working on to recruit more, you know, young Black talent into the industry, so all of those things are really exciting, but I hope that we move from, you know, ideas and pledges and speeches to actually doing things that intangible results. So yeah.
Aoifinn Devitt: And it’s interesting you mentioned Dawoud Kanaté Ahulu, who was on an earlier podcast and speaking about his initiatives around hiring more, 100 I believe, Black front office staff and into portfolio managers. And I’ve just seen, I think the speed at which these initiatives have gained currency, have gained a following, is that should give us all a lot of hope. I believe that this is not just about, as you said, pledges and statements, but it’s been followed by action, and that firms are increasingly being held to demonstrate that their action will follow. Just a final question around what advice you would give. You clearly are not looking back too far to the students perhaps in university, but if you were to give those students advice, what would that be today, knowing what you know now?
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Great. So I think I’ll tell people to lift their gaze, look beyond the horizon that they think they can see. Because what happens is that sometimes people make their dreams based on the interactions that they have with the people around them, so that can be quite limiting, especially if you’re from an underprivileged background. You think nobody from my family has been to uni, so it’s okay that I’ve been to uni, but you don’t even think about how much more that you can do for yourself. So even when people say that you can’t be what you can’t see, I still think that there’s a power of imagination. So maybe people can leverage that power of imagination so well. There’s a book by a guy called, I think, Yuval Noah. He wrote Homo sapiens. And in there, he was talking about how human beings are differentiated from other animals because we have the power of imagination, and I think that’s really powerful. So I’d encourage young people in university to imagine more, to dream bigger dreams, to aim above the sky so that if you fall, you are just at the sky, and not be limited in their dreams and in the scope of who they can be. So that’s definitely one thing I’ll challenge people to do, and it’s not just saying that to them. If I spoke to somebody, I’ll say, well, if you challenge yourself to dream bigger, what would that look like? What would that be? How would you work towards that?
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, thank you, Justyna. Thank you for your imagination. You are such an inspiration, and I can’t wait to see how far you will climb and all those women you lift with you. So thank you again, and thank you for sharing your insights with us.
14. 14. Justina Etteh: Yeah, I appreciate it. I’m so glad for this opportunity.
Aoifinn Devitt: I’m Aoifinn Devitt. Thank you for listening to the 50 Faces Podcast. If you liked what you heard and would like to tune in to hear more inspiring investors and their personal journeys, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be construed as investment advice, and all views are personal and should not be attributed to the organizations and affiliations of the host or any guest.
