Luigi Lewin: But I think the other sometimes overlooked unofficial ERG is the ally network, right? I have read studies that indicate that for a person to come out in the workplace fully, and this may not be true today, but it certainly was a few years ago, it on average takes 6 to 7 interactions with perceived allies before someone feels completely comfortable bringing their full self to work. That was certainly my experience. It wasn’t an overnight process. It was a few conversations with some trusted colleagues who were also friends at the beginning, and then it kind of evolved from there. But I think the work that the ERGs, particularly the LGBTQ ERGs, do to support allies, to give them the tools to show up as sponsors, as mentors, is key to this process.
Aoifinn Devitt: I’m Aoifinn Devitt, and welcome to this 50 Faces Focus Series in which we are celebrating LGBTQ+ professionals in a special series for Pride Month 2025. I’m joined today by Luigi Lewin, who is Senior Vice President and Head of Partnerships at GLAAD. He formerly spent 25 years on Wall Street, where he worked in a series of roles in sales, relationship management, operations, and business development until he left to move to the nonprofit sector. GLAAD is the largest and most visible nonprofit advancing LGBTQ+ acceptance. Welcome, Luigi. Thanks for joining me today.
Luigi Lewin: Thank you. It’s great to be here.
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, we’ve got a lot to talk about, but let’s start by talking about your background. Can you tell us where you grew up and what your early interests were?
Luigi Lewin: Sure. I grew up in New York City, in Manhattan, actually. And early interests, I can tell you, were, were certainly not Wall Street or nonprofits. My early interests were really trying to find a way to give back in some way. And so from a very early age, I volunteered through schools and other programming to donate my time, get involved in local organizations that supported the community. And I think that that’s what kickstarted ultimately my journey to the world of nonprofits.
Aoifinn Devitt: And before nonprofits, though, you did cycle through Wall Street for a period. Can you tell us about your role there? And 25 years, it’s got to be quite a few lessons learned.
Luigi Lewin: Indeed, yes. I spent 25 years on Wall Street, starting in New York. I was fortunate enough to work in Japan, in Hong Kong, in Italy, and in London during all of those years. And I think I fell into the industry almost by accident. I was at a career fair at my college just 6 or 7 months before graduating, and and met with a number of different companies that came to recruit. And an alumni who worked at a major Wall Street bank had set up time to meet with me. We had a great conversation. And from that connection, I ended up going straight to Wall Street after graduating and started my career at Morgan Stanley in fixed income operations.
Aoifinn Devitt: I actually hadn’t known you’d spent so much time around the world when it comes to our discussion about LGBT acceptance in the workplace. I think it will be really interesting to hear your perspectives from different regions. So now you moved to the nonprofit space. Can you maybe talk to us through why you left Wall Street and why GLAAD?
Luigi Lewin: As you know, I spent 25 years on Wall Street. I started out in operations and progressively moved into different roles, mostly but not exclusively in fixed income. As I progressed, I made the transition over to equities and equity derivatives. And that’s really where I guess you could say I finished my career. And that was when I was at Credit Suisse. After 25 years, I really needed a change. I felt as though the industry is constantly changing and is challenging and rewarding to work in at the same time. I honestly was just tired. I was on the road a lot. I was working long hours. I wasn’t really spending a lot of time at home with family. I needed a shift. I needed something that would leverage the skills, the discipline, and the sort of great work ethic that I learned and thrived in and with on Wall Street and repurpose it into something else. And I knew from about halfway through my 25 years that it would have to be the LGBTQ space. And I say that because the journey that I had on Wall Street really offered me a lot of perspective on coming out, the needs of the community, and what skills and experiences I had over those 25 years that could be repurposed into making a meaningful impact on the community that I represent, but also help it thrive by raising money, raising money for different programs, funding grants that support many, many different aspects that touch the community from healthcare to youth to emerging talent. So there were all these ideas that were swirling in my head that were a combination of my experience on Wall Street with a desire to do something for my community. And that’s why I made the switch.
Aoifinn Devitt: And Les, before we talk about GLAAD and the work that it does, can we go back to your own coming out story? Were you always out in the workplace? Did that happen at a certain point of your career?
Luigi Lewin: I was not out on Wall Street officially. I’m sure people knew. I wouldn’t say that I went to great lengths to hide who I was, but there was an element of, I guess, what we call covering, which is probably a term we don’t use so much anymore. But at least I hope folks don’t have to use that term. But in some spaces, maybe they do. I started working on Wall Street in 1994. The world was a different place then. I was really focused on more than anything else as I entered the industry. I had a good understanding of what I was getting myself into, and I always believed the most important thing was to be known as being reliable, competent, collaborative, and learn skills and have knowledge that people could leverage all around me. That was my main priority. Who I was as a person didn’t seem to factor in, and maybe it was because of my age at the time or the environment that we were in. But, you know, I spent a lot of time anonymizing what I did over the weekend. I would have conversations with people that were, you know, yes, I hung out with friends or I went on a trip, but never any conversation, you know, about a boyfriend or meeting a boyfriend’s parents or anything like that. I suppose that I did that because I wanted to make sure that no aspect of my personal life would interfere with my career trajectory. I was very career-focused, as a lot of people are in that industry. And I mentioned to you at the beginning that I traveled all over the world through my time on Wall Street. And that was both a gift and a challenge because I had to reinvent myself in the workplace over and over again before I officially came out to my colleagues. So I moved from New York to Tokyo, which came with the challenges of learning an entirely new workplace culture. Being in a country that I’d never lived in before and didn’t know very much about. And so again, the focus was always on relating to my colleagues, being reliable, being collaborative. My personal stories didn’t seem to factor into any of my engagement with folks. But slowly, many of my colleagues let me know that if I wanted to signal something, if I wanted to talk about who I was, it would be okay. I picked up on those signals early on And that was a very big part of what ultimately enabled me to bring my full self to work.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s beautiful to think that that came from your colleagues. I think that really is a huge step forward, and I hope others are lucky enough to be surrounded by colleagues like that. Before, we’ve talked on this podcast a little bit about code switching and about the stress that that can cause. And I would imagine once you did feel comfortable bringing your whole self to work, you no longer had to worry about some of that code switching. And did that kind of lift a burden in some way?
Luigi Lewin: It really did, because you spend so much energy in your day-to-day. In my case, it was always on a trading floor, which the environment is intense. And if you overlay that with constantly having to adjust your own personal behavior, how you engage with other folks, not being able to be your full self, it really gets exhausting very quickly, right? Again, you’re very focused on that trading floor, on detail, on transactions, on speed and accuracy. And if you think about having to double back and think about, oh, what did I say, or what did I not say? And if I had a conversation or an engagement with a colleague where we might have both known about each other’s story, what did that look like? And having to go back and think about all of those things, it does weigh on you. And it also, I think, has the potential or had the potential to affect professional performance. So that was a major factor in wanting to figure out a way quickly to just be myself. And as I figured it out, I realized that there really wasn’t so much risk that I thought there was. And I think I attribute that, or I know I attribute that to the approach that I’ve always had in interpersonal relationships in the workplace, which is to lean in with empathy. I did that from the beginning. I think I leaned in with empathy originally because I felt as though I was part of a marginalized community. And so I always had to compensate for that in some way and get people to like me. Get people to relate to me. But I turned that whole approach around very quickly, very early in my time on the street, and realized that the best possible relationship I could have with colleagues is one of mutual interdependence, trust, and being known as a subject matter expert. The rest would come through a lot easier if I had established that first. And so as I made the switch and began to relax about who I was in the workplace, it all started to fall into place a little bit easier. And a lot of that I think is also attributed to just general trends and changes in workplace culture. A lot of LGBT equality in the business world probably began on Wall Street. Many Wall Street firms, the industry was known as being at the forefront of being more accepting and supportive of the LGBT community very early. When you look at marriage equality, for example, among the first businesses that signed on to the amicus briefs were Wall Street banks. So there was this sort of natural evolution of my journey with all of these things happening around me that made it possible for me to quickly adjust and be open and honest about who I was.
Aoifinn Devitt: And when you now look at the work that GLAAD is doing to promote acceptance of the LGBTQ+ community, I’d love to talk about that, but maybe can you first kind of give us a snapshot of the state of acceptance in the area in which you focus, which I presume is mostly North America? And then what’s at the forefront of your mind as you promote acceptance now?
Luigi Lewin: Well, a lot of our work is about visibility and representation. And if I look back at, you know, those first couple of years on the street, the amount of representation and visibility, particularly in media, which is where GLAAD spends a lot of its time, wasn’t quite as built out as it is today, but it was certainly on the upswing. And having characters in film, in television, people talking about their personal experiences in ways that maybe they didn’t in the ’80s or the early ’90s made a difference. Right? And so the work that GLAAD did back then and still does today creates those spaces, creates those stories and the environment for those stories to thrive. And so while we didn’t have terminology like influencers and, you know, there was no social media 30 years ago or 40 years ago almost when I got my start on Wall Street, I think the evolution of that representation has made a big difference in people’s lives and particularly professionals in the industry. Seeing people who look like them, sound like them. It also opens up social conversation in the workplace, which also helps people relax and come out and be who they are in a setting where, you know, you’re in the work 10, 12 hours a day.
Aoifinn Devitt: And just to be clear, is GLAAD’s work across all industries, not just the finance industry? It’s a nonprofit-focused—
Luigi Lewin: We, yes, while our work is, uh, was traditionally rooted in entertainment and media, we work with all different types of Fortune 500 companies across all industries.
Aoifinn Devitt: The reason I, I pointed out is I think there are certain industries where, you know, certainly like medicine, for example, where representation, knowledge, education, familiarity is key. It almost becomes a health issue, a life and death type of issue. It’s even more critical And it’s, I think, raising awareness throughout many industries is key. And when you look at the gestures or the actions or the policies that promote acceptance, and what triggered this question is really thinking about that wonderful gesture from your colleagues who made you feel safe revealing your true self. What have you found to be particularly effective at promoting this culture of acceptance just within the workplace, like whether it’s affinity groups or pride celebrations, that kind of thing?
Luigi Lewin: Yeah, absolutely. I think it’s all of those things. We were fortunate to have ERGs. I think the term affinity group, when sort of the focus groups were initially created, the titling of those groups changed a few times and were rebranded. And I think, you know, right now we’re probably settled on, you know, employee resource groups. I think those were very helpful tools and are very helpful tools in the workplace. But I think the other sometimes overlooked unofficial ERG is the ally network, right? I have read studies that indicate that for a person to come out in the workplace fully, and this may not be true today, but it certainly was a few years ago, it on average takes 6 to 7 interactions with perceived allies before someone feels completely comfortable bringing their full self to work. That was certainly my experience. It wasn’t an overnight process. It was a few conversations with some trusted colleagues who were also friends at the beginning, and then it kind of evolved from there. But I think the work that the ERGs, particularly the LGBTQ ERGs, do to support allies, to give them the tools to show up as sponsors, as mentors, is key to this process. It’s key to having a rich culture of acceptance, of openness, and creating a path for folks to feel comfortable being their full selves at work, bringing their full selves at work and being their full selves at work. So that interaction with allies can be a conversation, it can be a manager, or it could be, as is often the case on Wall Street, when you’re hoping to get promoted, it’s usually a committee decision and you Often need to go around and get support from many different folks who can vouch for your performance, your knowledge. You often have to really be performing the role at the next level before they officially give you the title. And so going around and finding those sponsors and those mentors, signaling to them just how much they mean to you as a person in helping shape and propel your career, but also what they represent to you as allies. I think is a very, very important part of the journey. And it can be a quiet conversation. It could be a colleague who is an ally who has a pride flag on their door, outside their office, on their desk, on the trading floor. We had a lot of those at the different places that I worked at. I was also very fortunate to lead an employee resource group at one of the global banks that I worked at, where it was really built out from scratch, right? I was working at a firm that was growing very quickly in the US and really wanting to build a culture while also building out a huge book of business. And the entrepreneurial spirit that that firm had at the time extended to building out ERGs, not just for LGBT employees and allies, but other folks who were looking for that kind of cohort within their workplace community.
Aoifinn Devitt: And you’ve spoken about the movable middle and working with the movable middle. What does that mean to you?
Luigi Lewin: Look, I think we’re in a very different place now where so many things are polarized and the political narrative that swirls all around us, I know probably most of us just want to get away from it, avoid it, or certainly not have it become part of the discourse in the workplace. But the way I look at what the movable middle is, is folks who we as a community can bring along to support us, who understand our stories, where we came from, what challenges we’ve experienced, what obstacles lie in our way towards full equality, who understand the changes that our community has experienced all the positives, but also the negatives that have come with it. To me, that best illustrates who that sort of cohort of what I think is a very large and probably a majority of folks, I hope anyway, in this country who believe in that. And I say that because if you look back at the marriage equality movement a decade ago, a little bit more than a decade, it was with lightning speed that businesses, politicians, civil society all rallied behind the concept of marriage equality because everybody understands what love is, right? You can’t really argue with that. And I believe, and I think a lot of organizations that work in this space also believe this, that that’s where you have the best examples of your movable middle. It’s the folks that you can bring along to support you, who can help influence and shape the narratives and create the paths that we need as a community to achieve full equality.
Aoifinn Devitt: Hear, hear. Well, I think that movable middle could be mobilized in many walks of life, but it’s great to think of how you, you’re going ahead and doing it in this segment, which is so critical. I’d love to go back to your personal journey now. Were there any key people in your career or life that had a particular influence on you?
Luigi Lewin: Oh, there were many. I mean, I think 25 years, I guess, feels like a long time. I have many colleagues who are still in the industry who have now crossed the 30, 35-year mark. I think, you know, if I look back to growing up, I had teachers and coaches who were out, who growing up, you know, that was obviously an exception and not the rule. And Those folks were early role models and some of those folks were, you know, one of the first people that I came out to actually was a high school teacher who really helped me in those early, early days of figuring all of this out before I even engaged my family or even some of my friends on who I was, who I am, who I was then. In the workplace, there were many. I was very fortunate in that, again, my approach, I think I attribute this to my approach with empathy and listening and collaboration, I think earned me a lot of really wonderful colleagues who I strongly feel wanted to support me, wanted to see me thrive, and were very helpful to me in letting me know in many different ways that it was completely okay with them and that it should be okay with the majority of folks all around us. So those individuals If not for them, I don’t know that I would have lasted as long as I did in the industry. I was very focused on moving forward and moving ahead in my career, so I had to seek out mentors and sponsors, and I was very deliberate in that process. I made sure that it wasn’t a transactional relationship. I would often have conversations over coffee or in someone’s office about the authenticity of that relationship. I didn’t want it to just be a way to get to the next level, to grow my remit. I I wanted those conversations and the time that we had together to be a really good understanding of just how important that space was to me. I learned a lot from them and I shared that with them in ways that I think were very authentic. And so without those individuals, I don’t think I would’ve gone on to the next firm and finally the third firm before I ended up leaving the industry. I was fortunate to be surrounded with so much support. That’s, I think, one of the things that I credit with keeping me in the industry as long as I was employed there.
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, I think it’s great that you have shouted out to some of those high school coaches and influencers because they don’t always realize the impact they have. So I think it’s important that we, we all remain available to be that safe space for anyone to confide in us. So, so thank you for that reminder. And just last few questions, my last one, well, second last, I got to sneak another one in, is about any Cree dermatology that you might have or any words of wisdom just to sum up how you see the world?
Luigi Lewin: From the perspective of the workplace, I will say lean in with empathy. It pays a lot of dividends. I think that it’s really important to build relationships based on trust. It’s hard in any workplace. Trust isn’t something that is often talked about on Wall Street because in many ways it’s an industry where individualism is certainly championed, but I think, you know, you can only be as good as the team that you’re part of. And that’s one of the things that I really enjoyed about my time on the Street was that in almost every experience that I had there, I had something like 10 or 12 different roles over those 25 years. Almost all of them were in teams that were high-performing and in many cases, high potential. From my perspective, I think the way I related to the individuals in those teams came from, obviously, we were fortunate to be thrown together in the chaos of a trading floor environment, but being helpful, being resourceful, being a trusted colleague, but also someone who would be willing to lean in with information, with support, I think was key. I think flattery will only get you so far, but trust is very important. And I attribute that to just my— I mentioned it a bunch of times, but empathy is key. Understanding what the person you’re engaging with is up against is a great communications tool to hone in on in those settings. I think other things really are— I’m a little bit of a perfectionist. I’m not ashamed to admit that. And with that comes a lot of focus on detail. And so again, I think in the world of financial services, I think you absolutely have to be detail-oriented to succeed. And so with that focus on detail and being known as a subject matter expert and relating to colleagues with that without any bluster, I think is a workplace ethic that I think has paid dividends for me as I transitioned out of Wall Street and into the world of nonprofits.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s wonderful. I love the bluster-free advice. Any advice you would have for your younger self, or is that pretty much the, the same?
Luigi Lewin: Anything for my younger self would probably be If I knew back then what I know now as an out person, I think I probably would have expended a little bit less energy on hiding who I was. And I wonder if there were things that I missed during that process that could have shaped my career trajectory in a different way. I’ll never know. And I don’t— I’m not someone who looks back in regret. But I hope that the culture of openness and acceptance in the workplace continues because so much has been achieved and there’s still so much more work to do. But if you can remove those barriers and that energy that you have to spend on focusing on who you are and what you choose and choose not to disclose, if that can all melt away, the possibilities can be endless.
Aoifinn Devitt: I love that. You’re not the first who has said something similar about wondering what life might have been like had they been out earlier or sooner or leaned in. But as you said, we’ll never know. But I would like to ask the final question, which is around your state of hope, I suppose, at this point around LGBTQ+ inclusion. We are at an interesting crossroads, perhaps, in terms of corporate policies around DEI, inclusion, explicit support How do you keep the faith, I suppose, and remain hopeful?
Luigi Lewin: Well, there’s certainly a lot of noise and a lot of news cycle that would have you believe that the concept of DE&I, the infrastructure around DE&I is going away. I firmly believe it’s not. I think that there are some companies that have been very public about moving away from it, but I find that the majority are actually not. And I say that because there are two things that I genuinely believe corporate America absolutely wants to focus on and deliver for. One is that major companies want to be recognized as employers of choice when it comes to talent. And so those firms, those companies that are really focused on attracting, retaining, and supporting LGBTQ and other folks are the ones that I think will win out. I think the other factor that has me believe that DE&I won’t go anywhere. It may be rebranded or repurposed in different spaces. Companies don’t want to lose focus of who their consumer segments are. Who are they marketing themselves to? Right? Not just from, you know, recruiting the best and the brightest, but also who are they selling their products to? Where do they need to or want to open bank branches or expand their businesses? They need a roadmap to that. And if you remove all of that, you’re flying blind. And I firmly believe that no company that is really focused on growing would do something like that and simply walk away from very valuable market intelligence that helps propel sales, that helps propel marketing, and ultimately growth. So I don’t think that DE&I is going away. So from a business lens, I think that a lot of these things are, you know, sort of temporary noise in the news cycle. But the reality is that it’s here to stay. I’m also encouraged by the fact that so many shareholder proposals that have been attempted to remove or significantly reduce the DE&I footprint aren’t succeeding. We’ve seen many, many companies with shareholders overwhelmingly supporting DE&I. Major companies like Costco and Disney have all signaled through their shareholders that they genuinely believe and support the work that is part of inclusion and diversity. So those things on a macro level give me hope that we may just be in a sort of temporary situation that’ll eventually change. The other thing is I look at sort of emerging talent and emerging leaders and the growth of the LGBTQ population. That’s a trend that’s just going to continue. And so I genuinely believe that there are so many that will probably not have to experience some of the awkwardness that I did early in my career and will continue to thrive in those places that they choose to work at where they can be their full selves. And that will help them be the most creative, the most focused, the most talented in the industries that they work in. So I don’t think that any of this is going away. And I think there’s plenty of evidence, despite the news cycle that we’re seeing every day, that gives me hope. I think we just need to get through what we’re going through right now. And I think ultimately we will.
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, that is a beautiful moment on which to end this. I think this sense of hope, the sense of human capital really being at the heart of what every company does and what we all— why we exist here. And I think it’s protecting that human capital is in everyone’s interest. So thank you for being the signal throughout the noise and for the work you’re doing with GLAAD, Luigi. It is appreciated. I think not everybody will shout out to you, but I think that the work you’re doing to advance acceptance is critical, not only for the LGBTQ+ community, but for every marginalized community. So thank you for coming here to share your insights with us.
Luigi Lewin: Thank you for having me, and thanks for having me tell my story.
Aoifinn Devitt: I’m Aoifinn Devitt. Thank you for listening to the 50 Faces Focus Series. If you liked what you heard and would like to tune in to hear more inspiring professionals and their stories, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be construed as investment advice, and all views are personal and should not be attributed to the organizations and affiliations of the host or any guest.
Luigi Lewin: But I think the other sometimes overlooked unofficial ERG is the ally network, right? I have read studies that indicate that for a person to come out in the workplace fully, and this may not be true today, but it certainly was a few years ago, it on average takes 6 to 7 interactions with perceived allies before someone feels completely comfortable bringing their full self to work. That was certainly my experience. It wasn’t an overnight process. It was a few conversations with some trusted colleagues who were also friends at the beginning, and then it kind of evolved from there. But I think the work that the ERGs, particularly the LGBTQ ERGs, do to support allies, to give them the tools to show up as sponsors, as mentors, is key to this process.
Aoifinn Devitt: I’m Aoifinn Devitt, and welcome to this 50 Faces Focus Series in which we are celebrating LGBTQ+ professionals in a special series for Pride Month 2025. I’m joined today by Luigi Lewin, who is Senior Vice President and Head of Partnerships at GLAAD. He formerly spent 25 years on Wall Street, where he worked in a series of roles in sales, relationship management, operations, and business development until he left to move to the nonprofit sector. GLAAD is the largest and most visible nonprofit advancing LGBTQ+ acceptance. Welcome, Luigi. Thanks for joining me today.
Luigi Lewin: Thank you. It’s great to be here.
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, we’ve got a lot to talk about, but let’s start by talking about your background. Can you tell us where you grew up and what your early interests were?
Luigi Lewin: Sure. I grew up in New York City, in Manhattan, actually. And early interests, I can tell you, were, were certainly not Wall Street or nonprofits. My early interests were really trying to find a way to give back in some way. And so from a very early age, I volunteered through schools and other programming to donate my time, get involved in local organizations that supported the community. And I think that that’s what kickstarted ultimately my journey to the world of nonprofits.
Aoifinn Devitt: And before nonprofits, though, you did cycle through Wall Street for a period. Can you tell us about your role there? And 25 years, it’s got to be quite a few lessons learned.
Luigi Lewin: Indeed, yes. I spent 25 years on Wall Street, starting in New York. I was fortunate enough to work in Japan, in Hong Kong, in Italy, and in London during all of those years. And I think I fell into the industry almost by accident. I was at a career fair at my college just 6 or 7 months before graduating, and and met with a number of different companies that came to recruit. And an alumni who worked at a major Wall Street bank had set up time to meet with me. We had a great conversation. And from that connection, I ended up going straight to Wall Street after graduating and started my career at Morgan Stanley in fixed income operations.
Aoifinn Devitt: I actually hadn’t known you’d spent so much time around the world when it comes to our discussion about LGBT acceptance in the workplace. I think it will be really interesting to hear your perspectives from different regions. So now you moved to the nonprofit space. Can you maybe talk to us through why you left Wall Street and why GLAAD?
Luigi Lewin: As you know, I spent 25 years on Wall Street. I started out in operations and progressively moved into different roles, mostly but not exclusively in fixed income. As I progressed, I made the transition over to equities and equity derivatives. And that’s really where I guess you could say I finished my career. And that was when I was at Credit Suisse. After 25 years, I really needed a change. I felt as though the industry is constantly changing and is challenging and rewarding to work in at the same time. I honestly was just tired. I was on the road a lot. I was working long hours. I wasn’t really spending a lot of time at home with family. I needed a shift. I needed something that would leverage the skills, the discipline, and the sort of great work ethic that I learned and thrived in and with on Wall Street and repurpose it into something else. And I knew from about halfway through my 25 years that it would have to be the LGBTQ space. And I say that because the journey that I had on Wall Street really offered me a lot of perspective on coming out, the needs of the community, and what skills and experiences I had over those 25 years that could be repurposed into making a meaningful impact on the community that I represent, but also help it thrive by raising money, raising money for different programs, funding grants that support many, many different aspects that touch the community from healthcare to youth to emerging talent. So there were all these ideas that were swirling in my head that were a combination of my experience on Wall Street with a desire to do something for my community. And that’s why I made the switch.
Aoifinn Devitt: And Les, before we talk about GLAAD and the work that it does, can we go back to your own coming out story? Were you always out in the workplace? Did that happen at a certain point of your career?
Luigi Lewin: I was not out on Wall Street officially. I’m sure people knew. I wouldn’t say that I went to great lengths to hide who I was, but there was an element of, I guess, what we call covering, which is probably a term we don’t use so much anymore. But at least I hope folks don’t have to use that term. But in some spaces, maybe they do. I started working on Wall Street in 1994. The world was a different place then. I was really focused on more than anything else as I entered the industry. I had a good understanding of what I was getting myself into, and I always believed the most important thing was to be known as being reliable, competent, collaborative, and learn skills and have knowledge that people could leverage all around me. That was my main priority. Who I was as a person didn’t seem to factor in, and maybe it was because of my age at the time or the environment that we were in. But, you know, I spent a lot of time anonymizing what I did over the weekend. I would have conversations with people that were, you know, yes, I hung out with friends or I went on a trip, but never any conversation, you know, about a boyfriend or meeting a boyfriend’s parents or anything like that. I suppose that I did that because I wanted to make sure that no aspect of my personal life would interfere with my career trajectory. I was very career-focused, as a lot of people are in that industry. And I mentioned to you at the beginning that I traveled all over the world through my time on Wall Street. And that was both a gift and a challenge because I had to reinvent myself in the workplace over and over again before I officially came out to my colleagues. So I moved from New York to Tokyo, which came with the challenges of learning an entirely new workplace culture. Being in a country that I’d never lived in before and didn’t know very much about. And so again, the focus was always on relating to my colleagues, being reliable, being collaborative. My personal stories didn’t seem to factor into any of my engagement with folks. But slowly, many of my colleagues let me know that if I wanted to signal something, if I wanted to talk about who I was, it would be okay. I picked up on those signals early on And that was a very big part of what ultimately enabled me to bring my full self to work.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s beautiful to think that that came from your colleagues. I think that really is a huge step forward, and I hope others are lucky enough to be surrounded by colleagues like that. Before, we’ve talked on this podcast a little bit about code switching and about the stress that that can cause. And I would imagine once you did feel comfortable bringing your whole self to work, you no longer had to worry about some of that code switching. And did that kind of lift a burden in some way?
Luigi Lewin: It really did, because you spend so much energy in your day-to-day. In my case, it was always on a trading floor, which the environment is intense. And if you overlay that with constantly having to adjust your own personal behavior, how you engage with other folks, not being able to be your full self, it really gets exhausting very quickly, right? Again, you’re very focused on that trading floor, on detail, on transactions, on speed and accuracy. And if you think about having to double back and think about, oh, what did I say, or what did I not say? And if I had a conversation or an engagement with a colleague where we might have both known about each other’s story, what did that look like? And having to go back and think about all of those things, it does weigh on you. And it also, I think, has the potential or had the potential to affect professional performance. So that was a major factor in wanting to figure out a way quickly to just be myself. And as I figured it out, I realized that there really wasn’t so much risk that I thought there was. And I think I attribute that, or I know I attribute that to the approach that I’ve always had in interpersonal relationships in the workplace, which is to lean in with empathy. I did that from the beginning. I think I leaned in with empathy originally because I felt as though I was part of a marginalized community. And so I always had to compensate for that in some way and get people to like me. Get people to relate to me. But I turned that whole approach around very quickly, very early in my time on the street, and realized that the best possible relationship I could have with colleagues is one of mutual interdependence, trust, and being known as a subject matter expert. The rest would come through a lot easier if I had established that first. And so as I made the switch and began to relax about who I was in the workplace, it all started to fall into place a little bit easier. And a lot of that I think is also attributed to just general trends and changes in workplace culture. A lot of LGBT equality in the business world probably began on Wall Street. Many Wall Street firms, the industry was known as being at the forefront of being more accepting and supportive of the LGBT community very early. When you look at marriage equality, for example, among the first businesses that signed on to the amicus briefs were Wall Street banks. So there was this sort of natural evolution of my journey with all of these things happening around me that made it possible for me to quickly adjust and be open and honest about who I was.
Aoifinn Devitt: And when you now look at the work that GLAAD is doing to promote acceptance of the LGBTQ+ community, I’d love to talk about that, but maybe can you first kind of give us a snapshot of the state of acceptance in the area in which you focus, which I presume is mostly North America? And then what’s at the forefront of your mind as you promote acceptance now?
Luigi Lewin: Well, a lot of our work is about visibility and representation. And if I look back at, you know, those first couple of years on the street, the amount of representation and visibility, particularly in media, which is where GLAAD spends a lot of its time, wasn’t quite as built out as it is today, but it was certainly on the upswing. And having characters in film, in television, people talking about their personal experiences in ways that maybe they didn’t in the ’80s or the early ’90s made a difference. Right? And so the work that GLAAD did back then and still does today creates those spaces, creates those stories and the environment for those stories to thrive. And so while we didn’t have terminology like influencers and, you know, there was no social media 30 years ago or 40 years ago almost when I got my start on Wall Street, I think the evolution of that representation has made a big difference in people’s lives and particularly professionals in the industry. Seeing people who look like them, sound like them. It also opens up social conversation in the workplace, which also helps people relax and come out and be who they are in a setting where, you know, you’re in the work 10, 12 hours a day.
Aoifinn Devitt: And just to be clear, is GLAAD’s work across all industries, not just the finance industry? It’s a nonprofit-focused—
Luigi Lewin: We, yes, while our work is, uh, was traditionally rooted in entertainment and media, we work with all different types of Fortune 500 companies across all industries.
Aoifinn Devitt: The reason I, I pointed out is I think there are certain industries where, you know, certainly like medicine, for example, where representation, knowledge, education, familiarity is key. It almost becomes a health issue, a life and death type of issue. It’s even more critical And it’s, I think, raising awareness throughout many industries is key. And when you look at the gestures or the actions or the policies that promote acceptance, and what triggered this question is really thinking about that wonderful gesture from your colleagues who made you feel safe revealing your true self. What have you found to be particularly effective at promoting this culture of acceptance just within the workplace, like whether it’s affinity groups or pride celebrations, that kind of thing?
Luigi Lewin: Yeah, absolutely. I think it’s all of those things. We were fortunate to have ERGs. I think the term affinity group, when sort of the focus groups were initially created, the titling of those groups changed a few times and were rebranded. And I think, you know, right now we’re probably settled on, you know, employee resource groups. I think those were very helpful tools and are very helpful tools in the workplace. But I think the other sometimes overlooked unofficial ERG is the ally network, right? I have read studies that indicate that for a person to come out in the workplace fully, and this may not be true today, but it certainly was a few years ago, it on average takes 6 to 7 interactions with perceived allies before someone feels completely comfortable bringing their full self to work. That was certainly my experience. It wasn’t an overnight process. It was a few conversations with some trusted colleagues who were also friends at the beginning, and then it kind of evolved from there. But I think the work that the ERGs, particularly the LGBTQ ERGs, do to support allies, to give them the tools to show up as sponsors, as mentors, is key to this process. It’s key to having a rich culture of acceptance, of openness, and creating a path for folks to feel comfortable being their full selves at work, bringing their full selves at work and being their full selves at work. So that interaction with allies can be a conversation, it can be a manager, or it could be, as is often the case on Wall Street, when you’re hoping to get promoted, it’s usually a committee decision and you Often need to go around and get support from many different folks who can vouch for your performance, your knowledge. You often have to really be performing the role at the next level before they officially give you the title. And so going around and finding those sponsors and those mentors, signaling to them just how much they mean to you as a person in helping shape and propel your career, but also what they represent to you as allies. I think is a very, very important part of the journey. And it can be a quiet conversation. It could be a colleague who is an ally who has a pride flag on their door, outside their office, on their desk, on the trading floor. We had a lot of those at the different places that I worked at. I was also very fortunate to lead an employee resource group at one of the global banks that I worked at, where it was really built out from scratch, right? I was working at a firm that was growing very quickly in the US and really wanting to build a culture while also building out a huge book of business. And the entrepreneurial spirit that that firm had at the time extended to building out ERGs, not just for LGBT employees and allies, but other folks who were looking for that kind of cohort within their workplace community.
Aoifinn Devitt: And you’ve spoken about the movable middle and working with the movable middle. What does that mean to you?
Luigi Lewin: Look, I think we’re in a very different place now where so many things are polarized and the political narrative that swirls all around us, I know probably most of us just want to get away from it, avoid it, or certainly not have it become part of the discourse in the workplace. But the way I look at what the movable middle is, is folks who we as a community can bring along to support us, who understand our stories, where we came from, what challenges we’ve experienced, what obstacles lie in our way towards full equality, who understand the changes that our community has experienced all the positives, but also the negatives that have come with it. To me, that best illustrates who that sort of cohort of what I think is a very large and probably a majority of folks, I hope anyway, in this country who believe in that. And I say that because if you look back at the marriage equality movement a decade ago, a little bit more than a decade, it was with lightning speed that businesses, politicians, civil society all rallied behind the concept of marriage equality because everybody understands what love is, right? You can’t really argue with that. And I believe, and I think a lot of organizations that work in this space also believe this, that that’s where you have the best examples of your movable middle. It’s the folks that you can bring along to support you, who can help influence and shape the narratives and create the paths that we need as a community to achieve full equality.
Aoifinn Devitt: Hear, hear. Well, I think that movable middle could be mobilized in many walks of life, but it’s great to think of how you, you’re going ahead and doing it in this segment, which is so critical. I’d love to go back to your personal journey now. Were there any key people in your career or life that had a particular influence on you?
Luigi Lewin: Oh, there were many. I mean, I think 25 years, I guess, feels like a long time. I have many colleagues who are still in the industry who have now crossed the 30, 35-year mark. I think, you know, if I look back to growing up, I had teachers and coaches who were out, who growing up, you know, that was obviously an exception and not the rule. And Those folks were early role models and some of those folks were, you know, one of the first people that I came out to actually was a high school teacher who really helped me in those early, early days of figuring all of this out before I even engaged my family or even some of my friends on who I was, who I am, who I was then. In the workplace, there were many. I was very fortunate in that, again, my approach, I think I attribute this to my approach with empathy and listening and collaboration, I think earned me a lot of really wonderful colleagues who I strongly feel wanted to support me, wanted to see me thrive, and were very helpful to me in letting me know in many different ways that it was completely okay with them and that it should be okay with the majority of folks all around us. So those individuals If not for them, I don’t know that I would have lasted as long as I did in the industry. I was very focused on moving forward and moving ahead in my career, so I had to seek out mentors and sponsors, and I was very deliberate in that process. I made sure that it wasn’t a transactional relationship. I would often have conversations over coffee or in someone’s office about the authenticity of that relationship. I didn’t want it to just be a way to get to the next level, to grow my remit. I I wanted those conversations and the time that we had together to be a really good understanding of just how important that space was to me. I learned a lot from them and I shared that with them in ways that I think were very authentic. And so without those individuals, I don’t think I would’ve gone on to the next firm and finally the third firm before I ended up leaving the industry. I was fortunate to be surrounded with so much support. That’s, I think, one of the things that I credit with keeping me in the industry as long as I was employed there.
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, I think it’s great that you have shouted out to some of those high school coaches and influencers because they don’t always realize the impact they have. So I think it’s important that we, we all remain available to be that safe space for anyone to confide in us. So, so thank you for that reminder. And just last few questions, my last one, well, second last, I got to sneak another one in, is about any Cree dermatology that you might have or any words of wisdom just to sum up how you see the world?
Luigi Lewin: From the perspective of the workplace, I will say lean in with empathy. It pays a lot of dividends. I think that it’s really important to build relationships based on trust. It’s hard in any workplace. Trust isn’t something that is often talked about on Wall Street because in many ways it’s an industry where individualism is certainly championed, but I think, you know, you can only be as good as the team that you’re part of. And that’s one of the things that I really enjoyed about my time on the Street was that in almost every experience that I had there, I had something like 10 or 12 different roles over those 25 years. Almost all of them were in teams that were high-performing and in many cases, high potential. From my perspective, I think the way I related to the individuals in those teams came from, obviously, we were fortunate to be thrown together in the chaos of a trading floor environment, but being helpful, being resourceful, being a trusted colleague, but also someone who would be willing to lean in with information, with support, I think was key. I think flattery will only get you so far, but trust is very important. And I attribute that to just my— I mentioned it a bunch of times, but empathy is key. Understanding what the person you’re engaging with is up against is a great communications tool to hone in on in those settings. I think other things really are— I’m a little bit of a perfectionist. I’m not ashamed to admit that. And with that comes a lot of focus on detail. And so again, I think in the world of financial services, I think you absolutely have to be detail-oriented to succeed. And so with that focus on detail and being known as a subject matter expert and relating to colleagues with that without any bluster, I think is a workplace ethic that I think has paid dividends for me as I transitioned out of Wall Street and into the world of nonprofits.
Aoifinn Devitt: That’s wonderful. I love the bluster-free advice. Any advice you would have for your younger self, or is that pretty much the, the same?
Luigi Lewin: Anything for my younger self would probably be If I knew back then what I know now as an out person, I think I probably would have expended a little bit less energy on hiding who I was. And I wonder if there were things that I missed during that process that could have shaped my career trajectory in a different way. I’ll never know. And I don’t— I’m not someone who looks back in regret. But I hope that the culture of openness and acceptance in the workplace continues because so much has been achieved and there’s still so much more work to do. But if you can remove those barriers and that energy that you have to spend on focusing on who you are and what you choose and choose not to disclose, if that can all melt away, the possibilities can be endless.
Aoifinn Devitt: I love that. You’re not the first who has said something similar about wondering what life might have been like had they been out earlier or sooner or leaned in. But as you said, we’ll never know. But I would like to ask the final question, which is around your state of hope, I suppose, at this point around LGBTQ+ inclusion. We are at an interesting crossroads, perhaps, in terms of corporate policies around DEI, inclusion, explicit support How do you keep the faith, I suppose, and remain hopeful?
Luigi Lewin: Well, there’s certainly a lot of noise and a lot of news cycle that would have you believe that the concept of DE&I, the infrastructure around DE&I is going away. I firmly believe it’s not. I think that there are some companies that have been very public about moving away from it, but I find that the majority are actually not. And I say that because there are two things that I genuinely believe corporate America absolutely wants to focus on and deliver for. One is that major companies want to be recognized as employers of choice when it comes to talent. And so those firms, those companies that are really focused on attracting, retaining, and supporting LGBTQ and other folks are the ones that I think will win out. I think the other factor that has me believe that DE&I won’t go anywhere. It may be rebranded or repurposed in different spaces. Companies don’t want to lose focus of who their consumer segments are. Who are they marketing themselves to? Right? Not just from, you know, recruiting the best and the brightest, but also who are they selling their products to? Where do they need to or want to open bank branches or expand their businesses? They need a roadmap to that. And if you remove all of that, you’re flying blind. And I firmly believe that no company that is really focused on growing would do something like that and simply walk away from very valuable market intelligence that helps propel sales, that helps propel marketing, and ultimately growth. So I don’t think that DE&I is going away. So from a business lens, I think that a lot of these things are, you know, sort of temporary noise in the news cycle. But the reality is that it’s here to stay. I’m also encouraged by the fact that so many shareholder proposals that have been attempted to remove or significantly reduce the DE&I footprint aren’t succeeding. We’ve seen many, many companies with shareholders overwhelmingly supporting DE&I. Major companies like Costco and Disney have all signaled through their shareholders that they genuinely believe and support the work that is part of inclusion and diversity. So those things on a macro level give me hope that we may just be in a sort of temporary situation that’ll eventually change. The other thing is I look at sort of emerging talent and emerging leaders and the growth of the LGBTQ population. That’s a trend that’s just going to continue. And so I genuinely believe that there are so many that will probably not have to experience some of the awkwardness that I did early in my career and will continue to thrive in those places that they choose to work at where they can be their full selves. And that will help them be the most creative, the most focused, the most talented in the industries that they work in. So I don’t think that any of this is going away. And I think there’s plenty of evidence, despite the news cycle that we’re seeing every day, that gives me hope. I think we just need to get through what we’re going through right now. And I think ultimately we will.
Aoifinn Devitt: Well, that is a beautiful moment on which to end this. I think this sense of hope, the sense of human capital really being at the heart of what every company does and what we all— why we exist here. And I think it’s protecting that human capital is in everyone’s interest. So thank you for being the signal throughout the noise and for the work you’re doing with GLAAD, Luigi. It is appreciated. I think not everybody will shout out to you, but I think that the work you’re doing to advance acceptance is critical, not only for the LGBTQ+ community, but for every marginalized community. So thank you for coming here to share your insights with us.
Luigi Lewin: Thank you for having me, and thanks for having me tell my story.
Aoifinn Devitt: I’m Aoifinn Devitt. Thank you for listening to the 50 Faces Focus Series. If you liked what you heard and would like to tune in to hear more inspiring professionals and their stories, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be construed as investment advice, and all views are personal and should not be attributed to the organizations and affiliations of the host or any guest.
